<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto">I’m sure many of you have no idea who I am, but I’ve been reading all of these posts by everyone and thought I’d chime in. My wife Julie and I started playing in FSPA back when it was located at the NOVA Annandale campus. My wife found it in its infancy and introduced me to it and we were loyal players until we moved away in 2006. What I remember about that experience is having a fun two hour escape from life, learning more about pinball, and hanging out with great people. When we moved back in 2011, I found John’s Place and played there until it shut down and had the same great experiences. I would sometimes get my butt kicked by Chris Newsome and a very young Ethan Blonders (who could barely see the playfield). I would always be amazed at how Scott Sidley could fix just about anything in exchange for a Mexican Coke. But I always looked forward to it and had a great time. I feel like these types of things are what most people remember about playing in FSPA. <div><br></div><div>I always seek out pinball when I’m anywhere that might have a machine. I’ve been to the pinball hall of fame in Vegas at each of the three places it’s been located. Bottom line…I consider myself a pinball enthusiast, yet I also have no idea what WPPR is nor do I really care (not to take anything away from anyone who does). I play because it’s fun and FSPA gave me an opportunity to hang out with other pinball nerds who can discuss rulesets and actually care. I’ve only competed in one tournament but that is because FSPA hosted it in Fairfax and it sounded fun. I’ve never been to Pinburgh. I have no idea if I have a ranking because I’ve never bothered checking. </div><div><br></div><div>So if anything I would be MORE interested in a casual league than a super competitive one. I would rather have fun in a format that works than play in a format that is worse because I’m never going to be a world class player. I just want to have fun, period. I did like one of the previous ideas of having the “casual” league start an hour or so before the “competitive” league. That way, you’re also not waiting for an hour for a machine to open up. </div><div><br></div><div>As far as the parties go, I only attended when they were at people’s homes so I can’t comment on the commercial locations. But other than getting to play well maintained games for free, I never really enjoyed the parties much anyway. I much preferred when the prizes were awarded immediately on site after the playoffs ended. If I were still playing, I wouldn’t attend parties and would either like an opt out or just nix them all together. </div><div><br></div><div>Sorry for the length of the email. 🙂</div><div><div dir="ltr"><div><br></div>Jeff</div><div dir="ltr"><br><blockquote type="cite">On May 12, 2024, at 12:25 PM, Steve Jones via FSPA <fspa@fspazone.org> wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">I've been playing in the league for 5 years (at least until Spinners closed..) and to be honest, I have no idea what a WPPR is..</div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sun, May 12, 2024 at 12:15 PM Dan Reynolds via FSPA <<a href="mailto:fspa@fspazone.org">fspa@fspazone.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto"><br id="m_-6372160088475600119lineBreakAtBeginningOfSignature"><div dir="ltr">It shouldn’t be surprising that people who don’t even play in the league anymore don’t care about WPPRs.</div><div dir="ltr"><br><blockquote type="cite">On May 12, 2024, at 9:45 AM, Stephen Jonke via FSPA <<a href="mailto:fspa@fspazone.org" target="_blank">fspa@fspazone.org</a>> wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr">
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<div dir="auto">As I said before, I’m absolutely in favor of dropping WPPRs and then doing what’s fun instead of what complies. On top of that, let’s just say that the FSPA shrinks as a result. Is that so bad? Suddenly house parties become an option again in that case. Though I suspect dropping WPPRs will not cause a mass exodus. <br>
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For me an issue is we no longer have a league in Maryland. I can’t drive to the VA locations every week. Or rather I could, but all that driving is not great. Don’t know what can be done about that. </div>
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<div name="messageReplySection">On May 11, 2024 at 2:09 PM -0400, Barry Schwartz via FSPA <<a href="mailto:fspa@fspazone.org" target="_blank">fspa@fspazone.org</a>>, wrote:<br>
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<p style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal;font-kerning:auto;font-variant-alternates:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;font-feature-settings:normal"><span>Party-I love a good pinball party and especially love reconnecting with old FSPA friends. <span> </span>I also appreciate party games and the surrounding friendly competition and they motivate me to attend. <span> </span>However, I generally am unwilling to travel an hour or more just for a party and frankly, pizza demotivates me. <span> </span>So, I have only attended sparsely in the past few years. </span></p>
<p style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal;font-kerning:auto;font-variant-alternates:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;font-feature-settings:normal;min-height:22px"><span></span><br></p>
<p style="margin:0px;font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal;font-kerning:auto;font-variant-alternates:normal;font-variant-ligatures:normal;font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;font-feature-settings:normal"><span>Competition format-I don’t care much about WPPRs as I don’t play enough events in a year nor am I good enough to be top rated. <span> </span>I started playing in FSPA and would happily continue without them. <span> </span>I’m in it for the balanced but friendly competition and camaraderie it brings. <span> </span>I’ve developed many friendships through league affiliation. <span> </span>The competition is also important to my experience as it excites me in a way that little else does. <span> </span>That’s why I participate in occasional tournaments. <span> </span>But, it’s immediate and local vs IFPAs state and world levels. <span> </span>So, I vote for the FSPA to focus on balanced friendly competition and frankly think too much attention is paid to WPPRs in the pinball community. <span> </span>The IFPA exists for the top 1%, not for me. </span></p>
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<blockquote type="cite">On May 11, 2024, at 11:57 AM, Dave Hubbard via FSPA <<a href="mailto:fspa@fspazone.org" target="_blank">fspa@fspazone.org</a>> wrote:<br>
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<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sat, May 11, 2024 at 11:08 AM Sergio Johnson via FSPA <<a href="mailto:fspa@fspazone.org" target="_blank">fspa@fspazone.org</a>> wrote:<br></div>
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<div>Calling the party contribution a “tax” is a bit unfair lol. It’s an association benefit that some folks choose not to take advantage of but that others like. The reality is that everyone subsidizes something else in the league that may not be for them, but someone else takes advantage of.</div>
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<div>Well, call it whatever you want, it's a part of dues that I'm essentially just setting on fire. I am FAR from alone on this. By your own admission, the party isn't self-sustaining and depends on significant no-shows to even happen. Is that healthy? It's probably getting worse with the rising cost of everything, and I assume that raising dues just to cover increased party costs is a non-starter (at least I hope it is). All I'm asking is to really rethink whether it's worth it, and offer an opt-out for those that have no interest. There's a way to find out for sure: do a survey, poll the playerbase, ask if people would rather pay $40/season with party, or $30/season and no party. Let's gather some data.<br></div>
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<div>There are players who have never made the playoffs or very rarely do, yet there they are, season after season contributing to the prize pool that frequently goes to the same subset of players at the top end. They’re subsidizing the prize fund. Some folks really don’t want to own a pinball machine, (I know, go figure!), but get entered into the drawing anyway. The party isn’t any different, and clearly $10 a head isn’t covering the costs of it. When we came up with the cost years ago it was with the assumption that not all would likely attend. I guess we could go to a “a la carte” system for all of it but it would be an administrative headache trying to keep track of who is “in” for prizes, party and giveaway. That said, we could make all of those optional and really get bare bones with it. Something to think about. Does the size of the prize pool or trophies matter to folks?</div>
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<div>This is disingenuous. FSPA's playoff structure has always included a multitude of divisions such that even the worst players in the league can have a legitimate shot at their division playoffs, and therefore win something. It's not just bad players subsidizing "the top end." No one is asking for opt-in (or opt-out) to the prize pool, which wouldn't make any sense. I don't think anyone is asking for an opt-out for the giveaway machine, it's essentially just a raffle.</div>
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<div>To your last question, the size of the prize pool doesn't entirely matter to me, as long as it's something. Trophies do not matter.<br></div>
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<div>The private feedback that I’ve gotten so far is that folks really hate the wide disparities in skill levels seen in the early weeks of the new system. It was not a fun experience for them. Unfortunately that’s the cost of doing business with the IFPA. If anyone has any additional feedback on that or other topics, I’d love to hear it!</div>
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<div>Just a feeling... but it might be time to decide whether FSPA wants to be a competitive thing or a casual thing. I know the party line in the past was trying to strike some sort of balance, but if people really hate the result of kowtowing to IFPA in an attempt to keep points, maybe it's time to pick a side. Believe it or not, I actually think you should lean into the casual side. Competitive players who care about points will continue to go to tournaments. FSPA can exist for the more casual/social side, and without having to worry about the IFPA, you can go back to the ladder system and/or do whatever you want.</div>
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<div> --- Dave<br></div>
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